Honesty in Sellers and a Pinch of Mane

Yesterday, I had a nice phone call with one seller, the owner of a pretty gelding.  Although he's a lovely horse, with nice bloodlines, and a very pretty head and neck on a good body and nice legs, he's off my list.  The seller allowed that he had been showing signs of intermittent soreness behind, that he works out of - her theory is that the lower hock joints might be starting to fuse, and she might be right about that as it sounds arthritic to me - and that he can also be "cold-backed" if not ridden every day - some crow-hopping - until he warms up (could be saddle fit, could be his hocks, could be something that could be remedied with chiro - I asked and she's never done chiro), and he also doesn't really want to go much - she bought him to do some reining and barrels and he's not up for that.  Sounds to me like a young horse who was started too soon and used too hard before she got him, and who's now sore - a very common problem in the horse world.  His issues might very well be fixable, but I'm not into fixable right now, and I want a horse that has go as well as whoa.  As Jane pointed out yesterday, these horses do exist. Nice looking horse, though, and a nice seller - she wants him to end up where he'll be used appropriately.  So far all the sellers I've talked to have been very open and communicative.

LuLo Designs/Blue Eyed Tango asked an interesting question - can you tell if sellers are lying, and what can you do to ferret out some real information about a horse?  Jane also warned about horses that are drugged before being shown to people - I'd like to think I could tell if a horse is drugged - horses that have been drugged feel and look different in subtle ways - I've unfortunately seen a lot of that in the horse world - but showing up early while the horse is still in the pasture and/or a second surprise visit ("I just happened to be in the area and was driving by your mailbox and I'd like to visit horse X one more time") can help flush this out - although if I suspected that a horse was drugged I probably wouldn't bother to come back.

I also prefer not to deal at all with horse dealers - they often claim to not know the answer to a question because "it's not my horse" but don't want you talking to the owner either - it's hard to get a good history on these horses and I've found that drugged horses are much more common with dealers (my apologies to all the honest dealers out there).  Joint injections "to fix up the horse for sale" also happen, although I think less with the type of horses I'm looking at than show/competition horses.  If I suspect the people like to do injections - the fancier the place and the more showing/competition they do, the likelier this is in my experience - I'll ask "when was the horse last injected and what joints" rather than "has the horse ever been injected" - sort of a version of "when did you stop beating your wife?".

Now, how to get accurate information?  I want to talk to a seller directly, and to a trainer if there is one.  I prefer sellers who show some interest in the horse ending up with the right buyer - these people tend to be ones who've treated their horses better. I focus on getting factual information rather than opinions - what is the horse's history - where do you get him, how was he trained, what has he done?  Not "is he good for trail-riding" but "how many times has he been on the trail, what sort of trails/where/how long/by himself/in company, what's his behavior on the trail, does he prefer to lead or follow, what does he do at walk/trot/lope".  I prefer questions that can't be answered yes/no or briefly - I want to get the sellers talking and if you keep them going they'll say all sorts of things, particularly if you sound sympathetic.  I think people are less likely to lie if they have to tell a complete, consistent story rather than answer simple yes/no questions.  You get the idea - this way of asking questions can be used for a lot of my other questions.  A seller who won't elaborate or talk freely, or who "doesn't know" takes a horse right off my list.

I also have a couple of questions that I call "defining the edges".  In addition to asking the standard "has the horse ever bucked/reared/bolted under saddle?", finding out what equipment the horse is ridden in will tell you a lot about the horse's training, the seller and the horse's behavior and likely problems.  I ask "what is this horse most suited for and what things is the horse less suited for?" I always ask "what's the worst thing this horse has ever done?"  Most people don't have a prepared answer to this one and you get interesting responses.  Another one I like is "if you could change one thing about this horse, what would it be?" - if there answer is "nothing" then I say "there must be something . . . " and leave a long silence - people hate silences and will usually rush to fill them - I use this a lot to get people to talk.  Another version of this one is "what do you like most about this horse?" followed up by "what do you like least about this horse?" Another one I use, although this one works better when I can see the person and their body language - "if you were me, what would you want to know about this horse that I haven't asked?"  (You've got to have someone who's already talking pretty freely, and finds you sympathetic as a listener, and can mentally put themselves in your shoes, before this one will work.)  This one gets some interesting answers - for someone who isn't a pathological lier, if there's a big defect you haven't heard about it may come out here.

Can I be misled or lied to? Sure, but I'd like to reduce the odds.  My objective is to screen out as many horses as possible so that the ones I go to see are real, solid candidates.  Of course the real test is to meet the horse, see it handled and ridden and handle and ride it yourself, but I'd like my "yield rate" (percentage of horses that are really good candidates, divided by total horses visited) to be as high as possible.  This also reduces my chances of buying the "wrong" horse just because I see it in person and find it sweet/pretty/nice when it has issues that should disqualify it.  For example, the horse whose seller I talked to yesterday would have been tempting in person, but I can more easily take him off my list because I've never seen him in person - the pictures the seller sent me are drop-dead gorgeous.

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Dawn and I had a nice session yesterday, bareback again - I tried two other saddles on her and they were no go, for her and me.  Getting relaxation at the trot is our challenge right now - she's even more forward than usual due to the cool, somewhat breezy fall weather we're having.  She wanted to do a bit on the trail - she may be finding the arena a bit dull - so we did a couple of small (100 yards or so) excursions in  two directions away from the barn.  Since she can move so fast if she spooks, I took the precaution of taking a pinch of mane in one hand just in case.  And, sure enough, as we were walking along next to the pond, a group of ducks flew up just behind her - she scooted forward a few steps.  I might have stayed put without the pinch of mane, but it helped me stay put and also meant I didn't catch her in the mouth.  I'm a big fan of a pinch of mane when things get dicey - say if you're on a horse that feels like it might be about to do a sit-spin, or are jumping a green horse or one that's likely to take an odd/big spot - in my mind the worst thing you can do to a horse is catch it in the mouth, and I'm also a big fan of keeping the horse between me and the ground at all times!